Talk:Second Great War
Name Is there a source for this being called the Second Great War? -- Dark T Zeratul 02:38, August 2, 2010 (UTC) :No, which is why there's that notice at the top saying it is conjecture. i.e. we're using only for organization purposes so we don't have to keep saying "four years after the Brood War"/"sometime in 2504"/"the next big space kablooey after the Brood War"/etc. all the time. - Meco (talk, ) 02:48, August 2, 2010 (UTC) Mar Sara, Zeratul & Artifact Missions Should we have an article for them ? -- [[User:Andra2404|'Andra2404']] !WARNING! Badge collector !WARNING! 15:18, September 26, 2010 (UTC) No. Those aren't optional missions and in the context of the storyline take place in a specific order. (Prophecy first, then Mar Sara, then Artifact and finally Char.) PSH aka Kimera 757 (talk) ) 15:22, September 26, 2010 (UTC) The Spirit of Things Hours of editing, I think probably deserves an explanation. Certainly a few things are up for debate, but hopefully the article's been improved. Anyway, a few things I'd like to bring up lest an edit war begin: At this point in time, I think the main issue is determining where and when SGW actually ends. The first assumption one might make is that the conflict stems from WoL to LotV. However, I'm not sure if that should really be the case. The thing to consider is the 'spirit' of the conflict, its 'essence.' For example, the 'essence' of GW is that it's protoss vs. zerg with terrans caught in the middle. The 'essence' of BW is that it's primarily a zerg civil war. So what then, is the essence of SGW? The threat of the hybrids? Maybe. But then again, isn't that also the essence of Armageddon? Hard to say. It really depends how the further storyline is framed-is Armageddon something to be avoided, or something that's inevitable, but can be fought on better terms in the altered timeline? Time will tell, but I'd rather avoid making sweeping statements in that regard right now. At this point in time, all we have to work with is WoL. It has a distinct ending to the phase, if not its conflict. The storyline of HotS, I think, will determine whether we frame it as part of that conflict, as part of Armageddon (which I think the story of LotV will be framed in one way or another) or make a seperate article, if at all. Under the modus operandi of WoL being the core of the conflict right now, I made some additions/alterations to reflect that. Firstly is the template. Kerrigan vs. Zeratul I think doesn't make a good image no matter how you see SGW, as it's before the conflict and so minor a battle that I don't think it captures its scope. The current one isn't the best there is, but it's hard to a get a decent terran vs. zerg picture. Which, I think, is WoL's essence, in the same scale as GW and BW. So the template reflects the major players-protoss and hybrids are really too minor in the frame of WoL, but the KMC I think deserves to take their place, given the extnesive mentions. Not so much the Umojan Protectorate though, as while it's mentioned, it's never depicted as actually battling the zerg (like Switzerland in WWII perhaps-fortified, but not fighting). Anyway, that was my main rationale, along with grouping events in sagas, such as the Dominion. Anyway, that's my explanation. Hopefully it's a good one.--Hawki 15:00, October 10, 2010 (UTC) :A good explanation in my opinion, indeed. However, I must disagree at one point, though. The KMC shouldn't be separated from the Dominion box. While they were unlikely to be alligned, it's pretty much sure they weren't battling each other neither (specially with the zerg running around the sector at will). So, I placed them in the same box, albeit separated with a line, because, alligned or not, they are all targets of the zerg. As you said, we must consider the essence of the conlict, which is, primarily, a terran vs zerg war. :As for the Umojan Protectorate, I think we should include it. This is not the case of WWII. Surely, the Umojans would love to stay neutral. But remember that the zerg don't care about allegiances, and I don't think they'd hesitate to attack an Umojan should they come across one. And since this is a sector-wide invasion, the Umojans are also in danger to be invaded. Just not as much as the Dominion is, since they control far less worlds than their authoritarian neighbor. Omega20 23:31, October 16, 2010 (UTC) Back on the subject, I've re-organized the faction box. It's not perfect, but I figure that HotS has effectively rendered there being too many factions for a column for each one. There's now effectively four terran factions (Dominion, KMC, UP and RR), at least three zerg factions (de facto Zerg Swarm and the two brood mother broods, plus any others that appear) and two protoss ones (Tal'darim and with the Kaldir mission, it's definately a case of bringing the Protectorate into the war proper IMO, even if one doesn't count the Ulaan mission or the Haven stand-off). Thought it best to organize by species here.--Hawki 03:20, July 9, 2011 (UTC) Lhassir I would want to know why Lhassirs dagger has been removed from the commander-infobox, because he died in the mission "Maw of the Void", when you shoot down the mothership.Overlord Divine 17:09, October 16, 2010 (UTC) :Because you don't have to destroy the mothership to win. Zeta1127 of the 89th Legion (talk) 17:11, October 16, 2010 (UTC) ::Ok. I see. But, maybe we should put an "optional dagger" or something like that.Overlord Divine 20:30, October 16, 2010 (UTC) :::We may add a white flag to both Lhassir's commander-infobox and Tal'darim combatant-infobox, that may serve to mark that they were defeated, surrendered or just gave up (since all artifacts were recovered and they suffered a major defeat at Ulnar), without necessity of killing the entire group and leader. Of course, we'd need to wait until the other two expansion packs are released, since they may appear latter on. Omega20 22:48, October 16, 2010 (UTC) :I'm not sure that's reasonable. They didn't surrender or give up; they were defeated. We're arguing over whether they were destroyed (they weren't... probably. I can't see Legacy of the Void making sense without having the Tal'darim around.) PSH aka Kimera 757 (talk) ) 23:02, October 16, 2010 (UTC) Other Terran Polities I barely found out what "polities" means, and I have a good vocabulary, another word might be a better choice. Zeta1127 of the 89th Legion (talk) 00:51, October 20, 2010 (UTC) I guess I never thought about that. What else could we use? Country? Stellar nation? There isn't much there that I can think of. PSH aka Kimera 757 (talk) ) 01:17, October 20, 2010 (UTC) Powers is the only thing I can think of, it seems a little bit less obscure. I mean polities does fit the context. Zeta1127 of the 89th Legion (talk) 01:31, October 20, 2010 (UTC) I avoided "country" and "state" because I thought they did not convey the gravitas of the organizations being described, especially given how we use the terms today (i.e. nation states occupying only parts of a single planet). I avoided larger terms (eg. "stellar something") because they were even more of a mouthful. Finally, I avoided "powers" it discounts any other polities that may be too small to be considered "significant"; the section title was supposed to point out that there were more terran polities involved than just the Dominion, even if we only know the activities of a few named examples. - Meco (talk, ) 03:28, October 20, 2010 (UTC) Findlay's role? I don't think we can include Findlay as a Raynor's Raiders commander, as he was working for both Raynor and Mengsk. In fact, at the end, he chose Mengsk. (Well, probably.) PSH aka Kimera 757 (talk) ) 22:11, July 7, 2011 (UTC) Hybrids Little word on hybrids, and adding them to the template. At this point in time, I don't feel they really belong on it, though that will likely change. No hybrids have been seen in HotS yet and hybrids appearing in force in WoL were either in Zeratul's flashbacks (not really part of the war proper) or in the Overmind's vision, which is covered in the Armageddon article. As mentioned, they will no doubt be faced in the 'present' of the games, but as mentioned in the Armageddon talk page, it's a bit iffy as to when SGW ends and when Armageddon begins in regards to conflict seperation. Hybrids may end up being reserved for the latter.--Hawki 09:43, September 6, 2011 (UTC) HotS Order Sorry for the stubs, but only have so much time. Basically going by the order on the DVD in terms of sections, but arranging them so that it's clear that certain mission sets have to be played before others (e.g. Char, Kaldir, and Zerus have to be played before Skygeirr and the space missions). Something to mention on the canon page probably.--Hawki (talk) 14:05, April 11, 2013 (UTC)